Does Position = Power?

[Director]

We discussed some of the responsibilities of leadership yesterday in class.
Here is a question I'd like you to discuss here in this thread before the next meeting: Does position equal power?
In other words, do you suddenly gain leadership skills/ability when you attain a leadership position such as president, DM, CG captain, etc.?

If so, why?

If not, why not?

[amberTHEmonster]

I would have to say no. . . because
It is like JUST Because you have a name tag saying LEADER. . .DOESNT mean you know how to be one. . .

[Hi D Kim]

I say no also because all leaders continually learn something new by the ones they are teaching. You can always get better at something and improve in different areas..

[twangansta]

Just a quick reply, might add more when I think of more. :D

Does position equal power?

I will argue both ways, as from my perspective most things can be argued both ways.

For

First off with, yes you do gain leadership skills/abilities when you attain a position. Because you have to, without them no one will respect or follow you. Especially if you are someone out of the blue (ex. a new and younger doctor who becomes a leader at another hospital where there are more experienced ones), it is essential to develop those skills (adaptation) quickly or you will lose the job/position. Moreover, the lack of respect and recognition because you have a leading position will begin to get to you if you can't get what you supposedly deserve.

Personal experience is relating to when Mr. Mitts chose me to be Drum Major in the 03-04 year. I can't really recall (memories are a bit hazy :rolleyes:), but I will definitely proclaim that I was less social, talkative, etc then I am now (blame MUN :p). I remember Mr. Mitts calling me into his office for a talk because I didn't "take" up the position a few days after the announcement, but after that I tried my very best. It was up to me, and help from friends, past leaders, and the band director himself, to develop skills ranging from decision making to getting people under you to follow directions. Without it, you will not be an effective leader, causing harm to the organization and yourself emotionally.

Therefore, from the "pressure", I would call it, one does develop leadership skills when one attains a position. But it is not suddenly. If candidates have questions about this, I'm sure you can ask Nick or Jessica, and you'll get around the same answer (hopefully :cool:).

Against

However, this is just one side of scenario. It is entirely possible for one to gain a position but develop or have no leadership skills at all. It's entirely possible for a person to act the same as before they received the position, or even act worse.

By worse, I mean by abusing their powers. Giving punishments for not satisfying them is a common abuse of power made by people with decision, and instead of growing as a human being by developing leadership skills, they are digressing.

Comparing with my reasons for Yes a position equals power, a lack of leadership skills and an abuse of powers will usually result in the same result - no respect and harm to the organization. Therefore, a person may hold the position, but only by title. If their subordinates do not recognize them, they therefore have no power or influence whatsoever and have absolutely no need or development of leadership skills.

Contrasting with abuse of powers, a person can be unable to adapt to a new leadership position and "just can't cut it." Reasons will differ, but it will happen - people break under pressure or nervousness, and both are associated with being placed in charge of a large group of people.



I'm sure Mr. Mitts, having chosen so many leaders to lead the Tetzlaff Band, has seen various examples in a person's ability to lead or not once they attained the position. To sum it up, my belief is that it requires on a person's own integrity in not abusing their powers, and their ability to adapt so that they can develop new skills to address their group's concerns. No person has the necessary skills before they attain a position, no matter how much it seems like they do, because the future always has unexpected events that require different actions to take.


Whoo! that was long :trombone:. Comments would be nice and hopefully you guys didn't fall asleep reading it. If you did I'll :rimshot: you! :)

[jessicaWHOO]

Why don't you write a novel while you're at it, Michael xD
You make a good point though, and I totally agree with you.

Once you get a certain position amongst a group of people, you have certain responsibilities you need to carry out. Everybody knows that new people [candidates] don't often have the discipline to carry out their OWN responsibilites, therefor resulting in things not getting done, etc. If you hold a position, one of your responsibilites is to keep these kids in order, and to do so, you would have to be pretty demanding. This is where the position = power parts comes in. As Mr. Mitts said, you cannot ask an audience what to do, you have to tell them, or they won't follow you. Without power, it would be like asking the candidates to become more responsible and dependant, rather than simply telling them to change their immature ways.

But then again, power is only used when needed. If you obtain a position of your wishes, you cannot just go about and order people around. That's not the way a leader sets an example, and it certainly isn't any way someone should act. We often tell the DM candidates to do push-ups to not only work on their physical stregnth, but also to keep them disciplined so we can see who's more persistant. This doesn't mean that we are abusing our power; we're just trying to help them understand that they need it if they want to become a role model and leader for the future generations.



Mine is definitely not as long as Michael's, but I hope it's enough to let you all, especially the Tetzlaff Band and Color Guard's future leaders, see both sides of the Position = Power discussion :D

[iamthenick]

Wow. I totally agree to both of you guys.

[jessicaWHOO]

LOL.
Would you like to extend on that, Nick? xD

[twangansta]

LOL.
Would you like to extend on that, Nick? xD

LOL! Yes please :D.

And Jessica what are you doing up at 12:55 AM?!?! :eek::eek::eek:

[iamthenick]

Sorry, you guys said everything. You left me with nothing to say. :cool:

[jessicaWHOO]

And Jessica what are you doing up at 12:55 AM?!?! :eek::eek::eek:

Right; well... about that xD
Bahaha.
I was up doing Mrs. Burk's homework T_T
& also finishing up my Chinese homework, which both took me FOREVER by the way.

[~rAcHeL~]

I say yes and no, because you shouldn't have any other special privileges than others, but you have to have some power to give orders to others. If you didn't have at least some power people wouldn't feel obligated to obey you.:D

[Zaraano]

hmm lets see, well position in band does determine your rank as a member, but I would say no, position does not equal power. Just because your number one in an instrument section or in color guard does not mean that your have special privileges, btu it does mean that you get the chance to help the band improve and beat Northpark next year, although we are already great!

[Hello_moto]

No, just because you got that position, doesn't mean you are the best suited for the job. Let say that someone gets a position and maybe has average leadership skills. That won't be the best because anyone could do better and that would not make the Tetzlaff Trojan Band and Color Guard the best it could be. So summarizing up my ideas, I would say that a new leader doesn't magically get leadership skills from somewhere, they have to earn the skills themselves or they aren't considered a leader.

[jessicaWHOO]

True, Eric. But that's how the band chooses its future leaders. We observe each candidate's characteristics to determine what they are best suited for. I don't have a point I'm trying to prove, but I just think that if you have a position, you should be the best at what you do.

[k9kkc]

I would also like to say no because position doesn't really give you much power over people and things. The only thing that u acquire through position is probably respect, but most likely not power.

[acemoon]

I say no... because of all the reasons stated above :D :confused:

[jessicaWHOO]

Have you candidates bothered to read the first page of this thread?
If you guys have, I'm sure your all of your 'no' answers should have a solid reason behind it. Share them :]

[twangansta]

Yeah...you need to type more than me :D.

Or at least as much as Jessica ;).

[jessicaWHOO]

LOLS.
Yes, kids; write a novel xD

[cl00l3ss4life]

By earning a position like president of DM or something like that it definentily does not mena that you can sudeenly have all the aspects needed to be a leader. Think of it like this. If a baby was elected president of the world would it know how to be the president? Or if some kid didn't ever go to leadership class and somehow maybe it was like bias or something and he gets picked he wouldn't suddenly know how to be the presidents and the aspects of a leader. It wouldn't just pop into his head that he needs to do this and he needs to be nice and now all he needs to know. It's just not possible. You have to learn.

Also if no one can ever know everything about being a leader. Everybody learns something new everyday. Teachers also learn things it's not like they know everything there is to know. They learn too. Anyways nobody can know everything and it doesn't just pop into your head all you need to know about a being a leader when you somehow become one.

[jessicaWHOO]

Ah, good point Gorden!
But, I'll restate what I said earlier. Leaders are chosen because they are able to lead. Of course, each of us will learn a little throughout the process, but should start out with a good amount of leadership qualities to begin with.

[dolphin0705]

A position of leadership does not automatically give you power. All it does is give you the opportunity to get power. If you become a president of a organization, you will have power only if you have good leadership skills, persuasive ability, and the respect and the trust of others. If you don't have these things, you will probably not have much power even if you become president.

What is power? Power is getting people to do want him to do or stopping them from doing these that you don't want them to do. People are not going to listen to you or follow you just because you tell them to. People will do want you want them to do, if you set a good example as a leader or if you persuade them to do want you want them to do.

If you are a good leader, very persuasive, and if people respect you, you can have have power even if you are not president.You might even have more power than the president, if he is not a good leader. :D

[Director]

Well said, Johnny!

[jessicaWHOO]

Yeah, very nicely put :]

[ViNcEnTrOcKs]

hmmmm...
i think it does in a way and it doesnt in a way

[jessicaWHOO]

No?
How come, Vincent?